Will a Fiio e18 make an improvement?

af **Coach-Z** » 24. dec 2013, 11:36

Claus_DK sent me over here to ask you this.

I'm looking to improve my listening experience on my phone.

I'm currently using a Sony Experia Z Ultra, with either Poweramp or Neutron as my player.

After being recommended them by Claus_DK I bought a pair of Superlux HD681 2*32 ohm cans.

When I use them through a Aune Dac/amp hooked up to my laptop I get a vast improvement over the stock output.

If I buy a portable dac/amp for my phone, like the Fiio e18 will I get an improvement?

I read this article from NwAvGuy and as I understand it I'll probably end up with more problems than anything else.

http://nwavguy.blogspot.dk/2011/02/gain ... s.html?m=1

As far as I can understand him he's basically saying that these amps aren't necessary?

Sendt fra min C6833 med Tapatalk

af **davidsh** » 24. dec 2013, 15:24

On technicalities my e17 really pulls ahead of the iPhone in sound. Especially sound staging. With my ety hf5 I'm barely able to listen seriously to well recorded music through my iPhone. I tend to get pretty annoyed because of the closed sound and diffuse sound stage the iPhone offers. The e17 helps with that issue.
I find the DAC in the iPhone to be pretty good, yet the amp is rubbish.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

af **Coach-Z** » 24. dec 2013, 17:32

So You're saying that for you, your e17 makes an improvement?

Does the amp make the sound clearer or?

Sendt fra min C6833 med Tapatalk

af **davidsh** » 24. dec 2013, 19:16

Yeah it improves the sound for me, yet I actually quite like the tonality of the iPhone. The iPhone is just closed, slightly muddy sounding with an imprecise image and sound stage. The improvement is substantial, yet I wouldn't buy an e17 purely for use with my ety hf5's. The e17 cost me substantially more than those in-ears. We are talking diminishing returns...

One could say it sounds clearer yet that is a rather imprecise definition.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

af **Solderdude** » 24. dec 2013, 22:10

From a technical viewpoint you can get improvement on various fronts

Power consumption of the source is a tiny bit smaller (but not by much) but you probably won't notice the difference.

Another bonus an amplifier can bring are more power (smart phones usually don't have much output power) but efficient headphones don't need that much.
The HD681 is fairly efficient.
This is where NwAvGuy hints towards yet later on he designs a portable amp to give you more power.

The best reason to use an external amp, however, is to get better lows.
Most portable equipment rolls off the lows for low impedance headphones and the HD681 does have a low impedance but also has big bass so may not be that problematic in this case.
The 'load' an amplifier has on the phone is very light and thus there is no roll-off in the lows when an amp is used.

Some portable equipment also has (considerable) higher distortion when loaded with a low impedance headphone.
An amplifier, which provides a MUCH smaller load, will thus show lower distortion and sound better (when the portable equipment does have this problem)

I have no info about the mentioned Sony nor experience with the e18 but the used DAC is more than decent and power output in 32 Ohm (0.3W) is more than you will need.

Add to that the increase in gain and power output and it is safe to say adding a portable amp makes sense.

What NwAvGuy hinted at is that for instance when using a Sansa Clip and driving it to a certain level or driving the same headphone via an amp to the same level then it is pointless to use an amplifier.
In most other cases an extra amplifier makes sense.

af **Coach-Z** » 25. dec 2013, 01:07

So it might work out for me and it might not.

I'll try and see if I can find a model to try out before I do any shopping.

I really appreciate the input from you guys. Thanks.

Sendt fra min C6833 med Tapatalk

af **davidsh** » 25. dec 2013, 03:22

It'll not be day and night. At most you shouldn't expect more than a substantial improvement. Or perhaps it'll barely be worthwhile for you. Hard to say, really.

af **Coach-Z** » 25. dec 2013, 12:46

This guy says that his e7k, doesn't actually amplify the sound... its an okay dac, but a rubbish amp.

And what I need is primarily an amp.

http://www.head-fi.org/t/646060/my-revi ... -amplifier

I know the e18 isnt the same as the e7k, but come on, it doesn't exactly inspire trust in any of their products to read this.

af **Solderdude** » 26. dec 2013, 02:24

the E07k actually also works as an amp and is almost as powerful as the E18 (220mW vs 300mW in 32 Ohm) and has selectable gain (0dB, +6 dB and +12dB) where the E07 only has 0dB gain (=1x) and could be considered more as a power booster.

Only the older E07 doesn't really amplify when an analog source was connected, but the E07k does.

Consider FiiO in portable amp/DAC world as what Superlux is for headphones.
Biggest bang for the buck and more than decent quality.

If you do not need a DAC but only an amp there are other options as well but the FiiO offerings are something I would recommend.
I own the FiiO X3 myself (as well as the Sansa Fuze) and amp more than happy with those cheap players.

The Sansa is the more trouble free player of the 2 though and can be rock-boxed.